Socialized vs. Commercialized medicine

[Megaman FTW]

For the record, and for those who don't know what they mean already, I'll be defining the two words in short.

Socialized medicine is a system of health care in which the government pays for all necessary medical operations. Ergo, if you need a heart surgery to save you're life they'll pay for it but if you want plastic surgery to make your nose smaller then your on your own. Canada is known for having socialized medicine. The advantage to socialized medicine is that poor people can get the medical care they need. Eventually. The disadvantages are that it often takes an extremely long time to get the care you need, and many people die waiting for the treatment they need because the doctors wouldn't get to them in time. Socialized medicine also typically causes very high taxes.

Commercialized medicine is just what America uses. The government may place some health standards for hospitals etc, but mostly your on your own. You may buy health insurance to make it a bit easier to pay for expensive operations.

I personally favor commercialized medicine because health insurance is available to make anyone but a bum get their medicine cheap, and you don't have to wait longer than your life expectancy for your treatment. If I'm having a heart attack and the doctor says "We'll write you in for Friday", I'm going to come back and haunt some people.

For the sake of keeping things easier to read, we will spell the words SOCIALIZED and COMMERCIALIZED (with a Z) so that the language filter does not think we are trying to say CIA-LIS. Otherwise they appear as so******ed and commer******ed.

[EaterOfDogs]

Originally Posted by Megaman FTW

I personally favor commercialized medicine because health insurance is available to make anyone but a bum get their medicine cheap, and you don't have to wait longer than your life expectancy for your treatment. If I'm having a heart attack and the doctor says "We'll write you in for Friday", I'm going to come back and haunt some people.

Sorry - but your last sentance just proved you have no idea what socialized medicine is, and therefore, it's not worth the time to debate it.

[Hombre]

since you're a Canadian and in Canada they have socialized medicine....why don't you explain since you took the time to comment on the original poster's lack of knowledge on the subject....

or better yet...just don't post in here..

[Hombre]

Socialized medicine is a term used primarily in the United States to refer to certain kinds of publicly-funded health care.[1] The term is used most frequently, and often pejoratively, in the U.S. political debate concerning health care.[2][3][4][5][6] Definitions vary, and usage is inconsistent. The term can refer to any system of medical care that is publicly financed, government administered, or both.
Some say the literal meaning is confined to systems in which the government operates health care facilities and employs health care professionals.[7][8][9] This narrower usage would apply to the British National Health Service hospital trusts and health systems that operate in other countries as diverse as Finland, Spain, Israel and Cuba. The United States' Veterans Health Administration, and the medical departments of the U.S. Army, Navy, and Air Force would also fall under this narrow definition. When used in this way, the narrow definition permits a clear distinction from single payer health insurance systems, in which the government finances health care but is not involved in care delivery.[10][11]
Others apply the term more broadly to any publicly funded system. Canada's Medicare system, most of the UK's NHS general practitioner and dental services, which are all systems where health care is delivered by private business with partial or total government funding, fit this broader definition, as do the health care systems of most of Western Europe. In the United States, Medicare, Medicaid, and the U.S. military's TRICARE fall under this definition.
Most industrialized countries, and many developing countries, operate some form of publicly-funded health care with universal coverage as the goal. According to some sources, the United States is the only wealthy, industrialized nation that does not provide universal health care.[12][13]
The term is often used in the U.S. to evoke negative sentiment toward public control of the health care system by associating it with so******m, which has negative connotations in American political culture [14]. As such its usage is controversial.[5][6][4][15] A 2008 poll indicates that Americans are sharply divided in their views on socialized medicine, with a large percentage of Democrats holding favorable views, while a large percentage of Republicans hold unfavorable views. Independents tend to somewhat favor it.[16]

[Kovalchuk]

I'm gonna repost what I posted in the other thread b/c that's how it is and should be in america:

I guess some people just don't take advantage of living in the freeest country in the world.

Being forced into a heathcare system that makes you wait is not freedom. In America you have the responsibility to get an education, get a job, and pay for your health care plan. $160/month is not that hard to accomplish.

If your so poor that you can't afford health care, what are you doing buying video games and systems? It's not that 43 million people cant afford healthcare, it's 43 million people that do not accept the responsibility of budgeting their life for healthcare. In a free country it is up to you to cover your ass, if you choose not to so be it. Health Care is a personal choice, your gambling with your life if you choose not to budget for healthcare.

It would not surprize me if the same people that ***** (complain) about not having socialized healthcare are the same people that expect social security to take care of them COMPLETLY during retirement, this is another area where it is your responsibility to set aside money for the future but you have the FREEDOM not to which can come back to bite you in the ass.

I think alot of people don't understand what living in a free country means. For some reason, alot of people think it means they can live a lazy life where everything is "free" to them but I'm afraid that's not what our forefathers meant. lol

[EaterOfDogs]

Originally Posted by Wii_4_PE

Being forced into a heathcare system that makes you wait is not freedom. In America you have the responsibility to get an education, get a job, and pay for your health care plan. $160/month is not that hard to accomplish.

You really need to get out and understand the world more. There are many people out there who can't even afford food / housing / clothing. You need to take care of those things BEFORE you can even think about spending money on healthcare.

Originally Posted by Wii_4_PE

If your so poor that you can't afford health care, what are you doing buying video games and systems? It's not that 43 million people cant afford healthcare, it's 43 million people that do not accept the responsibility of budgeting their life for healthcare.

Again... you are out of touch with the reality of those who are in the lower income brackets...

Originally Posted by Wii_4_PE

It would not surprize me if the same people that ***** (complain) about not having socialized healthcare are the same people that expect social security to take care of them COMPLETLY during retirement, this is another area where it is your responsibility to set aside money for the future but you have the FREEDOM not to which can come back to bite you in the ass.

My wife and I have very good jobs... we save for retirement, play the stock market, save for our children's education and even buy additional healthcare coverage. Both of us have post secondary education, I myself have a bachelors and a diploma and graduated "cum laude". Even with all this, I still support Canada's healthcare system. Sort of shoots down your argument about only lazy people supporting eh? The fact is, the majority of Canadians support our healthcare system, and that includes people who are really well off.


Hombre : as per your request:

Canada's healthcare system attempts to provide basic healthcase coverage for all people, regardless or wealth or status.

This includes free doctor's visits, free spe******t visits, free operations / exams / x-rays / tests etc... it does not cover optional surgeries or cosmetic surgeries.

Medication is not covered by the plan for those earning over a certain income (i.e. I must pay for all any medication my family needs). Medication that is covered is the lowest priced generic equivalent of a name brand. In cases where people need a named brand or prefer it, the government will cover the cost of the generic, and they must make up the difference.

Wait lists are not because of a shortage of doctors or health care facilities, it is because we have universal healthcare, there are more people who have access to it. People who have money who don't want to wait will often go to the United States where you can buy your way to the front of the line.

You have a family doctor in Canada. When you feel ill you can call your doctor and make an appointment to see him/her. Normally the wait is 2 to 3 days. If you think the wait is too long, you can go to a walk in clinic where you can be served that day. The clinics are staffed by family doctors as well. All doctors can prescribe medicine and make recommendations for spe******ts / hospitals. If you need a hospital for emergency surgery or attention, you are dealt with right away. If you go to a walk in and they think you need emergency attention, they will transfer you to a hospital right away.

Right now the Canadian government is investigating licensing private hospitals. These hospitals would receive the same money that public hospitals do when treating a patient, but these hospitals would also be allowed to charge "more" than the government rate. In this way people with money who don't want to wait will be able to obtain care faster by paying a bit more. People who can't afford the extra fees would still obtain assistance through the public system. Many believe this will reduce waittimes overall because many people would take advantage of paying more for faster service, which will reduce the waittimes for those who can't afford to.

Canada's medical system is working... as previously posted, Canada's life expectancy is 14th in the world (the United States is 45th) and Canada's infant mortality rate (another statistic used to measure the success of healthcare) is the lowest in the world.

Hope that helps!

[Kovalchuk]

I'm not concerned with the "world" I dont care how a socialized country wants to do their healthcare, I'm talking specifically about the free country know as America. You have the freedom to be successful but you also have the freedom to be lazy which has consequences such as the inability to provide healthcare coverage for yourself. There's no problem with this system, this is the way a free society should opporate, I have no problem with America's heath care. In a free country you can not expect everything to be provided for you, that's not freedom, that's so******m.

[EaterOfDogs]

Originally Posted by Wii_4_PE

I'm not concerned with the "world" I dont care how a socialized country wants to do their healthcare, I'm talking specifically about the free country know as America. You have the freedom to be successful but you also have the freedom to be lazy which has consequences such as the inability to provide healthcare coverage for yourself. There's no problem with this system, this is the way a free society should opporate, I have no problem with America's heath care. In a free country you can not expect everything to be provided for you, that's not freedom, that's so******m.

Medicare is not "free" - all Canadians pay for it in terms of taxes. The difference is we believe in taking care of people who aren't as fortunate. We stand as a united Canada in the belief that the life of all Canadians are important. My posting of the position of Canada in terms of life expectancy etc... was merely to point out that Canada's system of health care is working. It is not "broken" with people dying left and right as you yourself stated.

Let me distill the argument down to its simplest form.

In Canada, we believe that good health and access to health care is a basic human right. From your arguments, in the United States, it is a priviledge.

And true feedom is anarchy - you do not enjoy "freedom" in the truest sense of the term. You must live by and within rules set out by your government.

[Kovalchuk]

Originally Posted by EaterOfDogs

In Canada, we believe that good health and access to health care is a basic human right. From your arguments, in the United States, it is a priviledge.

And true feedom is anarchy - you do not enjoy "freedom" in the truest sense of the term. You must live by and within rules set out by your government.

Yeah, I'll go along with that statement, of course true freedom is anarchy but I would America is the closest to true freedom.

[meatwad420]

Originally Posted by Wii_4_PE

Yeah, I'll go along with that statement, of course true freedom is anarchy but I would America is the closest to true freedom.

pfft. the netherlands have more freedom then we do.

have you not heard of the patriot act?